Environ-MENTALISTS??

Well, I've heard that as well, but I think its a pretty stupid way of looking at world population.

I think you need to look at what it was a little as 50 yrs ago, and look at what it is now, go back a hundred yrs and it gets even more interesting.

Plastics are one of the newer pollutants I must admit, but imagine if every plastic bottle was glass, how would that hit on the world's resources?

We just use up too much stuff full stop.
And then dont know how to get rid of it.

 

I've always thought that whatever we do we are putting off the inevitable.

Rearranging the deckchairs on the Titanic.

 

And yet, someone will object/put obstacles in the way, they always do. We can’t even agree on bottles!

 

Which is why recycling is so important

 

It doesn’t have to be like that, but I agree.

 

I personally believe that scientific opinion is flawed, and therefore, it may not be correct. With just one exception, every single report I have ever read has been wrong in one way or another. The one exception was ridiculed, despite being the most thorough I have seen to date.

We are told that pollution is causing the world to get warmer, which it is. Nobody ever seems to mention the fact that archeological evidence that proves the planet was warmer a thousand years ago than it is predicted to be in 50 or even 100 years time!

@Fat Controller this is really one of the most balanced things I have read regarding pollution. I take my hat off to you, sir!

In regards to electric vehicles. Of course, when they are in use they do not produce any pollution. The big problem is, they have produced it in other ways. Mining of some of the minerals to produce batteries, etc. Then shipping these across an ocean to refine them. Then shipping the refined metals half way across the world to make batteries for them. Not forgetting the fact that power stations have to make electricity to charge them. In case everyone has forgotten, even now, electricity supplies are having difficulty keeping up with demand. How will it be when everyone is driving about in electric vehicles, and more is needed?

A little bit about older diesels. Generally, these were regarded as noisy, smelly things that kicked out a lot of black smoke. Therefore, they are considered to produce more pollution than modern ones. Really, thats only because people compare old and new without knowing all the facts. How many are aware that older diesel engines can be converted to use other kinds of fuel? Including petrol, jet fuel, and even alcohol? The latter is of course a renewable fuel supply. Back in the 60's, 70's, thousands of these engines were produced....add a bit of modern technology to clean them up a little, and its entirely possible they will be classed as environmentally friendly. The odd thing is though, this technology cannot be used with more modern "common rail" engines at present.

Its exactly as was stated. Its just a government scam to tax the public.

 

Whilst stealth taxes annoy me - latest example is that our council now charge extra for emptying the garden waste bin (a service that I and many others haven't taken up), they are an easy way to change behaviour. I am now composting much more than I used to and have set up an extra compost bin.

Plastic bag 'tax' was mentioned in the thread. Look at the reduction in plastic bag use since the introduction of a measly 5p charge.

OK, reduce in plastic bag use is a drop in the plastic filled ocean but it demonstrates how a charge (or a refund) can change behaviours. It hasn't added to the cost of the weekly shop or put billions into the governments bank account.

The latest government consultations show that they are considering standardising waste collection across the uk. Whilst I am sceptical about this being realised, without having an end goal, things wont change.

We have finite resources and have to conserve those we have left. Without the investment in new technologies we will stand still. If we stand still, we will not survive.

 

Absolutely, which is why I’m in favour of taxes on plastics.

 

It would be even better to ban them completely! Of course, doing that would have two negative consequences. Shops supplying plastic bags, as well as other products would lose profits, and the treasury would not get as much in their coffers!

 

I'm sure that a lot can be done to reduce plastic use. Boxes containing bagged product with a plastic window to show the product, fruit and meat in plastic on a plastic or polystyrene tray spring to mind. If the government implements 'producer pays' correctly the type of packaging should be taken into account which would change the behaviours of the producers and bring us greener packaging. I know that ultimately the producer will pass on the cost of disposal to the end user so its not foolproof.

Recent examples of pringles packaging being highlighted as one of the worst for recycling, walkers being inundated with empty crisp bags in the post, proposals for the 'latte levy' on coffee cups have all pushed the producers to rethink their packaging. Lets hope that the upcoming recycling changes have a similar but wider impact.

 

I do agree with that. As I mentioned in my previous post, quite a few things can be totally banned. As examples:

I was reading the results on some research done here. In it, they came to the conclusion that artificial football pitches were a bigger pollutant than plastic bags. Thats something that I expect very few can even come to grips with! Another one that surprised me. The biggest pollutant in the oceans was found to be not plastic bags (they came in second place) but lost fishing lines, nets etc. Knowing the amount of plastic in the seas, the mind boggles as to how much of those can be in there. Of course, as I mentioned in one post, the report could be flawed.

Returning to plastic bags. They have introduced a system in Germany that is really quite sensible. Supermarkets there have two kinds of plastic carrier bags. A lighter one that costs (if memory serves correctly) €1. That is of course, a lot of tax. They also have a heavier, larger one that costs around €2,50. This money is, in its entirety is returned when the bag is returned. Even if the bag is damaged! So what happens is, they dont get the cheaper bag, but the more expensive one. Its used several times, then, when unserviceable is returned for a new one or the original cost. That is a far better system than just applying tax. Nobody loses, nobody gains.

 

@shiney as you are aware, I've not lived in the UK for a long, long time. The "bags for life" scheme is something I have never even heard of before. Recently, I've begun to realise just how much I have lost touch with a lot of happenings in the UK. I must get something done on our little project though, if you remember it.