Afghanistan deaths

Discussion in 'Off-Topic Discussion' started by HYDROGEN86, Sep 21, 2012.

  1. HYDROGEN86

    HYDROGEN86 Head Gardener

    Joined:
    Jul 17, 2011
    Messages:
    1,868
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    in the shed
    Ratings:
    +883
    I have just been reading about another 2 soldiers that have been killed in the Afghanistan war
    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-19683348
    It says they are both seperate shootings and are not to be though from hostile action...does that mean they were shot by Afghan police?...Im a bit confused.
     
  2. clueless1

    clueless1 member... yep, that's what I am:)

    Joined:
    Jan 8, 2008
    Messages:
    17,778
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Here
    Ratings:
    +19,594
    How can a shooting not be 'hostile action'? A gun is built for only one purpose, its impossible to use one in a non hostile way.
     
    • Like Like x 2
    • miraflores

      miraflores Total Gardener

      Joined:
      Apr 16, 2006
      Messages:
      5,484
      Location:
      mean daily minimum temperatures -1 -2
      Ratings:
      +2,389
      That is also my view. Officially speaking, it probably means that they were not two sides instructed to open fire one against the other, but it could have been for example a passer by or another accident.
       
    • HYDROGEN86

      HYDROGEN86 Head Gardener

      Joined:
      Jul 17, 2011
      Messages:
      1,868
      Gender:
      Male
      Location:
      in the shed
      Ratings:
      +883
      http://news.sky.com/story/985600/afghan-attack-two-uk-troops-shot-dead

      Had a look on sky news just now it seems it was Afghan police...i would class that as hostile action too!! And the BBC dont see it fit to tell us that why?? :wallbanging: Also i noticed it said that 6 harrier jets were destroyed during the attack on camp bastion, im pritty sure the BBC did not mention that either when they reported that one. :mad: its just says on the BBC website they "damaged aircraft and buildings" :gaah:

      http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-asia-19608561

      I dont know about anyone else but i really cant imagine the entire operation in Afghanistan making any difference what so ever once NATO forces leave?
       
      • Like Like x 2
      • clueless1

        clueless1 member... yep, that's what I am:)

        Joined:
        Jan 8, 2008
        Messages:
        17,778
        Gender:
        Male
        Location:
        Here
        Ratings:
        +19,594
        NATO should never have gone into Afghanistan. It was a daft idea. Granted, it was horrendous when the twin towers were destroyed, leading to war in Afghanistan, but it wasn't a country that attacked, it was a group. I don't remember hearing it on the news that NATO levelled parts of Ireland after Canary Wharf.

        But the past is the past. You can't change it. There's no much point dwelling on what might have been. The best we can do is learn from it. NATO should have learned that, for example, wars in Asia don't work because you can never be sure where the boundaries are or whose side anybody is on. The best outcome I reckon now is if NATO eases out, handing power to the locals, and letting them take the blame if things don't go to plan.

        As an aside, I was slightly amused by something on the news the other day. It was the US naivety that amused me. In response to some protest against Americans in Libya, someone in the US government (can't remember who it was) made some remark about how only a few months ago they (the US) and helped the Libyans, and he seemed utterly surprised that Libyans didn't appear to feel eternally indebted. This is why we should never intervene unless we're under direct threat. We've seen over and over again how you can't change a nation, you can only stir it up for a while.
         
        • Like Like x 3
        • HYDROGEN86

          HYDROGEN86 Head Gardener

          Joined:
          Jul 17, 2011
          Messages:
          1,868
          Gender:
          Male
          Location:
          in the shed
          Ratings:
          +883
          An arab news websites says that 51 NATO troops have been killed this year by Afghan police. Apparantly we are just misunderstood though.

          "NATO attributes around 75 percent of the attacks to grudges, misunderstandings and cultural differences. The Afghan defense ministry this month published a brochure for the Afghan army with advice on how not to misunderstand Westerners."

          Its the same with Egypt, the US have gave them billions and billions of dollars in aid, i think it was 30 billion they said (more than the rest of Africa put together), and what do they have to show for it...people burning the US flag in the streets and attacking theirs and our embacies!
           
          • Like Like x 1
          • clueless1

            clueless1 member... yep, that's what I am:)

            Joined:
            Jan 8, 2008
            Messages:
            17,778
            Gender:
            Male
            Location:
            Here
            Ratings:
            +19,594
            A few weeks ago I had a misunderstanding with my boss at work. Neither of us tried to shoot the other though.
             
            • Like Like x 3
            • HYDROGEN86

              HYDROGEN86 Head Gardener

              Joined:
              Jul 17, 2011
              Messages:
              1,868
              Gender:
              Male
              Location:
              in the shed
              Ratings:
              +883
              I`d check under your desk then for an IED :blue thumb:
               
              • Like Like x 1
              • pete

                pete Growing a bit of this and a bit of that....

                Joined:
                Jan 9, 2005
                Messages:
                47,721
                Gender:
                Male
                Occupation:
                Retired
                Location:
                Mid Kent
                Ratings:
                +84,376
                We should get out immediately, the place will return back to "normal" once we are gone.

                You cant take over a country and impose the government you want in power, things dont work that way.

                Lets face it, we cant even get a decent government here, so why are we trying to impose one in Afghanistan.
                 
                • Like Like x 1
                • "M"

                  "M" Total Gardener

                  Joined:
                  Aug 11, 2012
                  Messages:
                  18,607
                  Location:
                  The Garden of England
                  Ratings:
                  +31,885
                  There will always be problems when, what is considered a Western "superpower" intervenes and tries to impose western ideas and ideals into a culture which is so ingrained in ancient practices, ideas and ideals and, incredibly tribal at the heart of it. A clash of cultures.
                   
                • Jenny namaste

                  Jenny namaste Total Gardener

                  Joined:
                  Mar 11, 2012
                  Messages:
                  18,325
                  Gender:
                  Female
                  Occupation:
                  retired- blissfully retired......
                  Location:
                  Battle, East Sussex
                  Ratings:
                  +31,024
                  I am, and have always been, very uneasy about our meddling with the Desert dwellers. They are too different and we should leave well alone. Hate to think how much fruitless dosh has been wasted out there and as for the loss of life. Its abhorrent and I know I mustn't dwell on it - I cannot change the way the First World thinks. Very few dark patches in my comfy life but this is one of them.
                  Jenny namaste
                   
                • miraflores

                  miraflores Total Gardener

                  Joined:
                  Apr 16, 2006
                  Messages:
                  5,484
                  Location:
                  mean daily minimum temperatures -1 -2
                  Ratings:
                  +2,389
                  I don't follow wars and guerrillas on tv (I just change channels), but as somebody above mentions, I imagine it very possible that allies intervening during a conflict, can have problems effectively integrating with the local mentality, culture, way of life etc expecially in the space of a few days and under pressure.

                  Just to make an example: adhering to agreed plans from higher authorities is very hard to ask to people which don't plan even from one day to the next (sometimes they don't even know if they will eat one day to the next) as well as you never know what to expect from those that don't fear death because they believe in a wonderful afterworld or they are ready to die for their country.

                  To me if it was possible to improve standard of life in the countries of origin would be the best way forward, because a lot of conflicts exist because of poverty, and a lot of those citizen that live abroad hate every moment of it, and would glady return to their homeland and families if it was the decent thing to do.

                  Useful would be also to stop productions of weapons a stop broadcasting about wars for the next ten years.
                   
                • ARMANDII

                  ARMANDII Low Flying Administrator Staff Member

                  Joined:
                  Jan 12, 2019
                  Messages:
                  48,096
                  Gender:
                  Male
                  Ratings:
                  +100,834
                  I'm glad to hear that you've changed your work relationship then, Clueless!!!:lunapic 130165696578242 5:
                   
                  • Like Like x 1
                  Loading...

                  Share This Page

                  1. This site uses cookies to help personalise content, tailor your experience and to keep you logged in if you register.
                    By continuing to use this site, you are consenting to our use of cookies.
                    Dismiss Notice