Latest Moan From You and Me 2025

We have been known to have a similar remark about Edinburgh Castle being built too close to the railway line. Probably made by someone walking down Princes Street in their new kilt not realising you are meant to take the tacks out of the pleats.

 

Just been listening to Keir. I have never heard a more chilling speech. War kills. Civilians suffer needlessly. He really wants the whole country to get behind the idea of spending billions on arms when you can't get a GP appt? It is just an utter madness that the world cannot afford, either in terms of the resources poured in or the harms churned out. He wants to create jobs in the arms industry. The immorality is just stunning.

And the media egging him on is just nauseating.

 

@pete I used to get taken to Mildenhall airshow when I was a kid.

The Lakenheath and Raf fighters over head are just noise, it can be almost excruciatingly loud some times. It might be more entertaining if they went above the cloud, out of site.
We have had the spitfire doing pleasure flights out of norwich airport this weekend and the sound of a merlin engine is bliss in comparison.

 

Presumably Trump got Starmer by the short and curlies demanding we contribute more to NATO?

 

I think you need to ask Putin what his intentions are, China also.
It only takes one side to start a war.

 

But arms races can never be the answer. As long as making and selling arms is so profitable for the few, tax payer money will get funnelled in. It is a get-richer scheme run by the elite.

And, seriously, politicians' talk of valuing the armed forces is just as hollow as that claiming to value the nurses during Covid. Not enough to give them proper pay, but, hey, they got a round of applause so that's OK.

The world cannot afford the pomposity and aggression of a few leaders dragging everyone else to death and destruction. It is a wholly ridiculous scenario.

 

So bring on the perfect world
How do we achieve that.
A theoretical approach is fine, but has no bearing on reality.

 

Don't trade with aggressors. Don't allow arms sales by circuitous routes to states with dictators. Get clarity on who is benefiting financially from all the war talk. That is what the media should be doing, exposing the underbelly.

Unfortunately politicians love wars. It gives them lots of coverage, extra powers over the electorate, and the ability to siphon megabucks off to their wealthy backers in return for favours down the line. And the media loves war. Endless inexpensive coverage of dramatic, "human interest" events. Perfect.

 

I'm not sure I see the point of more submarines that will supposedly be used as a nuclear deterrent. I've not seen the story but how many times over do you need to be able to nuke the other side before you are happy. I really don't think that in the future much of our equipment will be very important because we can see what three years of war has already done to the way it is fought. Russia potentially lost a third of its nuclear bombers (if the stories are true) and a big chunk of their navy through essentially remote control toys.
The US had theoretical wars games where Taiwan was invaded and came to the conclusion that aircraft carriers would be easy target, with a few destroyed, yet I think they have commissioned more. I know submarines are more secretive and less easy prey but underwater drones are being developed which will probably make them obsolete as well. It might sound good to commission these new deterrents but the budget will boom and the timescale slip massively into the future when any potential war will have already started.

 

If they build these new submarines it's going to be 30 years before they are in service

 

And if the equipment is obsolete by then, will the tax payer get a refund?

Maybe we should buy the stuff on a use-or-return basis!

 

That sounds similar to the lib/Dem Cleggy about 15 yrs ago, he said no point in building nuclear power stations because it will be 15yrs before they are operational.
Short sightedness left us exposed at the beginning of WW2.

I thought I heard the Subs were Attack subs rather than carriers of nuclear weapons, but could be wrong.

I just find it strange that the main thoughts seem to be bury your head in the sand and leave your bum sticking out.

Apathy has got us where we are now.
Stick out the welcome mat.

 

It's not apathy, @pete. It's horror at all the war talk and the idea of more weaponry, made with the sole purpose of killing, floating about.

We have to find better solutions or every century will be blighted by major world conflicts. There's no such thing as a winnable war. Surely Vietnam, The Gulf, and Afganistan teach us that?

And if China were to kick off, even if we spend 99% of GDP on being prepared, we wouldn't stand a chance. And in any case, they would probably use technology like hacking vital systems (water etc) rather than boots on the ground.

 

Its not a world that is ever likely to happen where everyone gets on with everyone else, its not something human beings do, never have and never will.

Its a dream world, unless of course you let one dictator take over the whole world.
James Bond stuff.

Yes warfare is changing, it always has, but you cant leave yourself wide open.
The Russian planes that Ukraine destroyed recently just show how its changing.

The problem that Britain has always had is that for some reason we have always planned for policing the world rather than defence in the past.

 

If the profit were removed from war, it wouldn't happen. So, let's have all Keir's wish list ... but paid for by a special tax on the richest 1%, not from general taxation.

There will always be the odd despot with big ideas about expansion, of course. Stopping them in their tracks is more likely if they are going to suffer huge financial losses.

I don't want us to leave ourselves wide open. Use the money to ensure water systems are tamperproof. Bolster airspace defence technology so nothing can get past it. Ensure we have multiple ways of buying in things we need so we could cut trade with an aggressor without cutting off supplies. None of this need kill anyone.