Hit by a car

Discussion in 'Off-Topic Discussion' started by Jungle Jane, Dec 6, 2014.

  1. clueless1

    clueless1 member... yep, that's what I am:)

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    Bruises don't have to be visible. In fact in my experience they rarely are. Running down your back are some fairly major muscles that have a huge amount of strength (enough to hold your whole upper body upright against gravity) so they make up quite a lot of mass. Quite often with with such knocks, the bruising is deep below the surface, the skin might show no discolouration even if there is deep bruising underneath.

    I'd encourage you to see a GP. No cause for alarm or anything, just to figure out the fastest way to ease the pain. The standard advice seems to be to keep moving as normal so that you don't stiffen up but that's not always right, hence the need to get professional advice. Don't be tempted to go straight in with the deep heat or the cooling gels either, as which one you need depends on the nature of the bruising. Either can make matters worse. For example, deep heat encourages blood flow, which is great if the blood flow is impeded due to inflammation, but if the inflammation is happening because the finer blood vessels have ruptured (as happens sometimes in bruising) then cooling is best, but if you cool it when the pain is due to reduced blood flow, then again it will hurt more. Hence the need to see the GP.
     
  2. pete

    pete Growing a bit of this and a bit of that....

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    Dont want to sound unsympathetic but just let it drop.
     
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    • NorthantsGeezer

      NorthantsGeezer Total Gardener

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      If you admit to riding on the pavement, the admission may well get you a fine :sad:
      It would then be a case of weighing up if its worth it.
       
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      • longk

        longk Total Gardener

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        I have to agree. You are both in the wrong so it will be a tit for tat deal. The price of a foglamp for a modern car will be far in excess of a bike wheel.
         
      • Jungle Jane

        Jungle Jane Starved Of Technicolor

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        This is what I thought. But while I throw my hands up and know that I was partically to blame in my defense I am not the only cyclist to do it. I see motorists complain all the time about cyclists doing stupid things in the road. I use the road as much as I can but in this instant it wasn't practical and too dangerous. Also I was heading towards a cycle path which was meters away. How else could I have gotten to the cycle path without going across on coming traffic in the road and then got onto the cycle path.

        I have uploaded a map where it happened just to explain my predicament. The red mark shows where I was hit and the blue line shows the cycle path which I was heading for. You can see that the cycle path is broken up by two sets of traffic lights that lead onto a very busy bypass. In order for me to get to the cycle path I had to be on this side at I wanted to head down the east side of the cycle path. If I was on the road I would have had to negotiate with the traffic, cut across two ways of traffic going in two directions at the cross roads near the turn off of the A1014 and then somehow got off my bike onto the crossing, then crossed again with my bike on the cycle path, in order to get to the cycle path.

        map.png

        I'm sure there are other ways around this area on the road that I haven't fathomed out for myself yet but please point them out to me if you spot them :)
         
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        • shiney

          shiney President, Grumpy Old Men's Club Staff Member

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          Clueless has put it very well. Although Jane was in the wrong by riding on the pavement it doesn't absolve the driver of responsibility. The two offences are unrelated - albeit that they happened to be in the same place at the same time.

          Having said that, we can look at Jane's particular side of the situation. She was in breach of the law but in mitigating circumstances. In 1999 the government brought out an addendum to the law which allowed the police to give a Fixed Penalty Notice (FPN) of £30 in order to help them decide whether to ignore the situation, give a warning or take the cyclist to court. At the same time Paul Boateng, Home Office Minister, gave the police additional guidelines.

          "The introduction of the fixed penalty is not aimed at responsible cyclists who sometimes feel obliged to use the pavement out of fear of traffic and who show consideration to other pavement users when doing so. Chief police officers, who are responsible for enforcement, acknowledge that many cyclists, particularly children and young people, are afraid to cycle on the road, sensitivity and careful use of police discretion is required."

          Jane's explanation seems to fit neatly into Paul Boateng's category. So, it looks as though Jane would not receive any fine for breaking the law. At the worst she would get an FPN which is £30.

          Whereas the driver was totally in the wrong (assuming we have received the correct information - which we appear to have received). He seems to come under 3ZA(2) or 3ZA(4) of the Act (Driving without due care and attention or Driving without reasonable consideration).

          "The offence of driving without due care and attention (careless driving) under section 3 of the RTA 1988 is committed when the defendants driving falls below the standard expected of a competent and careful driver." (CPS guidelines)

          This leaves a matter of whether to pursue it or not. Jane seems inclined to wish to pursue it. In which case the first thing is to go to the doctor. At the same time she should go to the police to inform them of the incident. They are bound to ask her why she hasn't reported it earlier. The simple answer was that she was in shock - as someone mentioned earlier.

          Going to the police should produce an Incident Number (if the law hasn't changed in the last ten years she should be able to insist on this if the show reluctance to give one). They're unlikely to issue a crime number as that then affects their statistics, but an incident number doesn't - or didn't used to do so. @ARMANDII may know more about this.

          Without the Incident Number it may be more difficult to pursue the driver's insurance because the driver may refuse to give their details. It can still be done but becomes more awkward.
           
        • Scrungee

          Scrungee Well known for it

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          If it was reversing then there would have been reversing lights on and probably visible exhaust emissions in this cold weather (two things I look out for when driving through cars parks and get ready to hit brakes & horn, seems to happen at least once every week) which may have affected apportionment of liability. Sometimes it's impossible to make "all the necessary observations before and during moving off" such as when a large van has parked beside you, or reversing out of a driveway without vision splays and with walls/fencing/hedges either side and you don't have any passengers.

          But are there any witnesses? The driver and passenger may well say they the driver was looking out for footpath users and was edging out very slowly when a bicycle was ridden at speed behind them. What happens then? (I've got a handlebar bike cam)
           
          Last edited: Dec 8, 2014
        • shiney

          shiney President, Grumpy Old Men's Club Staff Member

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          I can't quite understand that scenario in the circumstances. Jane says that the damage to the car was on the front whereas the damage to her bike was from the side (should be evident from the actual damage).

          If the car was driving out the driveway forwards, as Jane says, then she could would have been seen by the driver, even if she was riding at speed, and he would have been hit from the side.

          If he claims he was reversing out of his driveway (could be considered driving without due care if reversing into a busy road) she would still have hit him from the side if she was riding at speed.

          Although the frontal damage could have been caused by deliberately swerving into the front of the car (in either circumstance) it seems highly unlikely and would normally be discounted as improbable.
           
        • Scrungee

          Scrungee Well known for it

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          Unless there's walls,fencing, hedging obscuring vision.


          P.S. J.J. Do you have legal expenses cover on your house insurance?
           
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          • shiney

            shiney President, Grumpy Old Men's Club Staff Member

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            Good thought. :blue thumb:


            Still no excuse in law. It's the drivers responsibility to take care if vision is obstructed. From Jane's description the driver must have driven straight out.
             
          • Scrungee

            Scrungee Well known for it

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            But what if they claim they did exit slowly, but the bike was being ridden at speed, expected the bike to stop as they were already partially onto the footpath crossover, but it carried on across the front of the car and didn't brake? Who has right of way on that vehicular crossover, a car using it to get on the road, or a cyclist using the footpath?

            I don't think there's enough information to make any judgements yet, especially without seeing what that driveway exit is like.
             
          • shiney

            shiney President, Grumpy Old Men's Club Staff Member

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            I seem to remember, when learning to drive, that we were told to expect every other person to do exactly what you wouldn't think they should do. Or words to that effect!

            Neither. :)
             
          • Scrungee

            Scrungee Well known for it

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            We must have had the same driving instructor!
             
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            • Val..

              Val.. Confessed snail lover

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              If I was you Jane I would move on now. It seems like the 'blame' is 50/50 and the damage to car/bike is about 50/50 so nothing really to gain by pursuing this.
               
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              • shiney

                shiney President, Grumpy Old Men's Club Staff Member

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                Val, not quite sure that's right. :)

                Scrungee and I have been giving the type of arguments that can arise in these situations. It helps to get things clear in the mind. :blue thumb:
                 
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