Whaaattt?

Discussion in 'Off-Topic Discussion' started by Tidemark, Aug 17, 2024.

  1. redstar

    redstar Total Gardener

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    Why would the political party want to change the tax laws, some folks in the political party like it that way so they can gain extra money also. Also, the rich hire accountants that specialize in such to complete proper paperwork. They also know things, like Trust Funds or other Legal paperwork to protect monies to hand down to the next generation. All of which is written out there for anyone to look up. Also many of the rich develop jobs/companies and hire folks, that helps with the economy. I don't see poor people start companies and hire folks.
    Tax laws also cover donations, when you hear, such and such donated XXX, trust me they use that donation as a tax deduction. There are so many other factors that inter weave with tax laws. If the laws are changed too much then the little man may not be successful. The percentage of the rich is very low compared to the percentage of the middle class .

    Besides tax laws there are also Regulations that also affect many businesses. Why do we have regulations, some have more than others. With a greater amount of regulations come a greater amount of policy needs and staff to carry out that policy. So why do we need regulations, because humans will try to get away with stuff to benefit themselves. Take an example, 40 years ago with the concept of a Personal care home for elderly, that book of regulations was a Half inch thick. Today it is now 2 inches thick, Why, because humans took the Half inch thick one and played between the lines, causing issues, and problems, so the government had to step in over and over again, re vamping that book, to head off folks that just want to take advantage of things.
     
  2. shiney

    shiney President, Grumpy Old Men's Club Staff Member

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    @redstar I agree that the ultra rich can afford to employ tax lawyers and accountants to get around a lot of the regulations (I qualified as an accountant in 1962 but didn't continue - and I'm sure I could work on some regulations that may not be worth their while trying to circumvent :whistle:)

    We certainly do need entrepreneurs to be encouraged to provide the boost to the economy and provide jobs but there is a limit to how much they should be able to avoid.
     
  3. Obelix-Vendée

    Obelix-Vendée Total Gardener

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    People get around regulation because the rules are not well thought out and they need to be made by poachers rather than gamekeepers to have fewer loopholes. It also comes down to education about community and personal responsibility and the greater good.

    There are plenty of very rich people who use their personal fortunes to funs homes for the homeless, hospital care, education fees, animal rescues and such but there's a hard core few - Musk, Bezos, Murdoch and the like - who are just plain greedy and want it all without caring about our planet from ecology to humans to all living things. Trump is a wannabee catch-up but of that ilk.

    As long as anyone, at any level of society, believes they can lie, deceive, rob, steal, exploit, bully and even kill with impunity there will be people who abuse and use others and act surprised if someone complains. It comes down to socialising and educating everyone from infancy and having adequate systems for catching/punishing/re-educating those who transgress.

    Housing regulations, food safety regulations, animal husbandry regs, recycling rules, employment regs, environmental regs etc are all there for our mutual protection and should be updtaed and improved as new technology and science informs us and not just be an obstacle to get round.
     
  4. Philippa

    Philippa Gardener

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    There's no doubt some of the ultra rich do put some of their wealth to good use and should be commended. However, many don't and have no intention of doing so.
    Little point in expecting most governments to make alterations to the tax laws which would benefit their less well off citizens at the expense of their "friends ". The average person is a cow to be milked until the abbatoir looms.
    Britain is said to be one of the world's richest countries ???
     
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    • Obelix-Vendée

      Obelix-Vendée Total Gardener

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      It does show a lack of understanding, imagination and courage by our politicians that they feel unable or unwilling to tackle financial inequalities.

      managing money.jpg
       
    • redstar

      redstar Total Gardener

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      Let me tell you a strange "Loop hole law" in the USA anyway. If on your property, even many acres, you have a family graveyard plot. that property is free from property taxes. So there you go, is one little unknown way to save money. And that property can be worded correctly in some trust to be handed down over generations without any inheritance tax also. it is all about working smarter not harder. To search out what "they" know and apply it to you. Even the little man can find things which are available online or in libraries. Complainging does not get you anywhere, use that energy to seek out information.
       
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      • redstar

        redstar Total Gardener

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        Regulations are there to protect us from WHAT? years ago in hospitals they had no clue that washing your hands prevented infection, then that became a regulation. Food service workers have to be cleared for any diseases. Working with children --regulation of background checks to make sure no sick person is working with them. On and on it goes.
        As an observer of human nature, I would love to think that improved education and community and personal responsibility would help decrease some regulations. @Obelix-Vendée . But I have seen too much in the medical field where supposed highly educated folks do stupid things.

        The regulation books with the loopholes just become thicker as someone uses one of them to better themselves or take advantage of it. The writers of the regulations cannot possibly think like the Loophole folks, but wait till its found and reword it.
         
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        • Philippa

          Philippa Gardener

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          That's certainly interesting about hand washing in hospitals @redstar - how many "years ago" are we talking about ?
          We often seem to have gone overboard in the opposite direction now - sanitise everything and dirt of any description ( within reason ) is frowned upon. Doesn't always help the immunity system tho.
          Came across a rather odd ( to me anyway ) comment re Dishwashers recently. Conversing with a friend in Canada about dishwashers breaking down, I happened to say that I had never used a dishwasher - all done by hand. Her shocked response was "But how do you sanitise your dishes ?" Hot water and appropriate liquid soap is all I use and I am still alive :biggrin:
           
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          • Obelix-Vendée

            Obelix-Vendée Total Gardener

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            @Philippa A hungarian doctor noticed the difference in outcomes when hand washing and hygiene practices were used in maternity wards in the 1840s. Florence Nightingale introduced these practices for nurses in the Crimean War - 1853 to 1856 - and revolutionised nursing practice. Joseph Lister introduced antiseptic principles to surgery in 1860 based on Louis Pasteur's germ theory and reduced mortality rates.

            Things that need regulating @redstar are foods - it was common practice in the 19th C to adulterate bread flour with all sorts of cr*p to maximise profits; building standards so homes and public buildings don't fall down in a puff of wind or, for some regions, in earthquakes; transport safety from road and rail building to all the vehicles that use them and things that fly too.

            For public safety and fair competition, everyoe needs to work to the same high standards which is one thing the EU is good at - raising standards for all - and which most people, especially competing economies fail to grasp. We don't want decreased regulations. we need sensible ones, designed for improving all life, not just humans.

            Maybe when the USA red states get their average reading level above that of our 11 and 12 year olds you can expect imprved knowledge and understanding in all those folk over there who think governance is bad.
             
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            • Fat Controller

              Fat Controller 'Cuddly' Scottish Admin! Staff Member

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              Regulation and governance can be good (the adulteration of foods such as flour is an excellent example @Obelix-Vendée), however over regulation can be equally as bad - for example the recent ADAS rules that have been applied to vehicles courtesy of the EU and clearly haven't been thought any further than the 'oh that sounds like a good idea' stage... so much so, they vary from being ruddy annoying all the way through to being dangerous. So yes, we do perhaps need to reduce some regulations, if only to get back to the sensible ones.

              Also, I think your comment regarding the reading level of anyone based upon their wishes, desires and voting preferences is un-called for - regardless of what anyone's intelligence level is, they have as much right to have their voice heard and vote counted as anyone else and as far as I am concerned many of the issues we are seeing with current political discourse result from people feeling that they are being condescended to - this much was quite evident in the UK around the Brexit vote and has continued ever since. Just because someone is clever doesn't mean they are automatically right.
               
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              • Obelix-Vendée

                Obelix-Vendée Total Gardener

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                I agree @Fat Controller - just being clever is not enough but I do think a certain level of intellectual ability such as reading and comprehension are essential tools for being informed and making decisions that affect others.
                 
              • Thevictorian

                Thevictorian Super Gardener

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                Like burying your ex wife on your golfcourse, I wonder who found that loop hole.
                 
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                • NigelJ

                  NigelJ Total Gardener

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                  Don't they have to be dead though?
                   
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                  • redstar

                    redstar Total Gardener

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                    What my travels have taught me is not every country gets solid NEWS about the USA. So with that said not going to respond to your statement.
                    Anyway, recently the state of Mississippi went from 50th in reading/math to 6th in the nation.

                    And I agree about food regulations, but that also starts with what is being planted, many crops are being played with genetically . Animals are being filled with hormones etc. I am so glad I live in Amish land, have organic food items available anytime.
                     
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                    • redstar

                      redstar Total Gardener

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                      For that answer, I could google it. It was only an example. And come to think on that subject, I do not recall signs going up in restaurant bathrooms about staff washing their hands until maybe 10 years ago. Sad we need a sign in the bathroom for the staff to remember to wash their hands.
                       
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