What are these?

Can anyone identify these plants please? The first one is popping up everywhere, the second (could've taken a better photo, sorry) is tamer, and looks a bit like sweet william, but we only had a very small sweet william four years ago which hasn't been seen since.

 

Thanks Jiffy. After googling, I think I agree with you. Very invasive from what I gather, so, a bit of weeding to do this weekend...

 

The second isn't a lily is it? Cheers, Tony.

 

No Tony, I don't think it's a lily. I do have them, but the flower head on the one in the photo (thanks to my photographic skills you can't see it very well!) is like a cluster.

 

2nd pic looks very much like Sweet William - perhaps it seeded? (I save seeds from my Sweet Williams).

 

I'd be happy if it was sweet william - that would mean the seeds have lain dormant for about 4 years.

 

I've been for a walk to my Sweet William patch and taken a few pics, and also found some Willow Herb for comparison.

Sweet Williams:



Willow Herb:




So they all look like Sweet William to me. Put the 'weeding' on hold!

 

Thanks for taking the trouble to do that scrungee. You're right, they do both look like sweet william! I suppose all will be revealed when they flower. (there's no smiley for 'patience')

 

Sorry all, I beg to differ I think the first one is Valerian.

 

They both now have exactly the same flower heads - more evidence in favour of a sweet william double?

 

Lovely pics Marley! I don't think either of them are willow herb now, as the leaves don't have serrated edges - I think I may have that in other parts of the garden!