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Mme. Alfred Carriere

Discussion in 'Roses' started by Novice Rob, Jul 21, 2019.

  1. Novice Rob

    Novice Rob Apprentice Gardener

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    Hello

    I planted this rose last spring (2018), but appear to have trained it rather badly as it is now a bit(!) top heavy (see attached photo). I believe pruning is not advised until winter, but was wondering if you had any advice as to the best way to proceed to achieve a more balanced distribution if major shoots (apologies if my terminology is incorrect).

    Any help would be much appreciated
    Rob 20190719_211429.jpg
     
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  2. wiseowl

    wiseowl FRIENDLY ADMIN Staff Member

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    Good afternoon @Novice Rob my friend and welcome to gardeners Corner,I wouldn't say the fault is yours,its the fastest grower I know,IMOH I would wait until November then prune it
    First, cut off most of this year's growth this keeps the framework of the rose clear and prevents the plant from becoming too woody.next, large woody stems are taken out – almost to the base – to encourage new shoots. These will flower the following year.
    the remaining branches are re-attached to the wall, stem by stem, starting from the middle of the plant, working outwards, with the pruned tip of each branch bent down and attached to the one below,hope this is of some help to you:smile:
     
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    • Novice Rob

      Novice Rob Apprentice Gardener

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      Thanks for that @wiseowl .
      I'm a bit nervous about pruning to be honest. A few years ago I was a bit heavy-handed with another of our climbers which is still struggling to recover.
      Still, nil desperandum, I'll give it a try.
      Much obliged
      Rob
       
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      • wiseowl

        wiseowl FRIENDLY ADMIN Staff Member

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        Hello @Novice Rob my friend no need to be nervous about your lovely Rose the harder you prune it the better, this will enable you to make a fresh start as if you have just planted it,just remember you control how the Rose grows not the other way round,but treat it with respect and kindness and it will reward you for the rest of your life,enjoy the rest of your day my friend:smile:
         
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        • ARMANDII

          ARMANDII Low Flying Administrator Staff Member

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          HI Rob, Woo (our recognised GC Rose Expert) is correct in every way


          THE SISSINGHURST ROSE PRUNING TECHNIQUE


          Climbers and ramblers
          The rose pruning season at Sissinghurst starts in November with the climbers and ramblers that cover almost every one of the terracotta brick walls.

          First, the gardeners cut off most of that year's growth. This keeps the framework of the rose clear and prevents the plant from becoming too woody.

          Next, large woody stems are taken out – almost to the base – to encourage new shoots. These will flower the following year.

          The remaining branches are re-attached to the wall, stem by stem, starting from the middle of the plant, working outwards, with the pruned tip of each branch bent down and attached to the one below.

          Climbers such as 'Paul's Lemon Pillar' are a bit more reluctant than ramblers like 'Albertine' and the famous Rosa mulliganii on the frame in the centre of the White Garden, which are very bendy and easy to train.

          The rose pruning philosophy can be summed up as "treat them mean, keep them keen". If you put every stem of a rose plant under pressure, bending and stressing it, the rose will flower more prolifically. The plant's biochemistry tells the bush it's on the way out and so needs to make as many flowers as possible.


          I have a Rose Madame Alfred Carreire lining a bank by my Wild Life pond and it's been there for around 10 to 12 years. It's a cracking rose and you've made a good choice with it. My pruning of the climbing roses by the pond is quite light, merely keeping them at the desired height, amd cutting back any over length stems that are merging with the other climbing roses that line the pond bank , but you will probably need to stick to Woo's advice:love30::thumbsup::)
           
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          • wiseowl

            wiseowl FRIENDLY ADMIN Staff Member

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            Good afternoon @ARMANDII and thank you my friend :redface:I am sure that our friend Rob welcomes your advice and help as much as I always have,the practical knowledge that you have gained over years of actually growing this lovely Rose and others is invaluable as is your friendship;):smile:
             
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            • Novice Rob

              Novice Rob Apprentice Gardener

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              Thank you @ARMANDII and @wiseowl . Hopefully I can follow your advice, as we had a profusion of flowers earlier in the summer and the scent was wonderful.
               
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              • ARMANDII

                ARMANDII Low Flying Administrator Staff Member

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                Well, Rob, don't worry too much about it as Roses are very tough and resilient All my roses survived my very early years as a gardener:heehee: Since you only planted the rose last year you will find it's still "finding it's feet" and will double or treble, easily, in size. I have found that most climbing roses tend to flower from about 4' or even 5' upwards rather than the base but then. as I said, my pruning tends to be more relaxed in tune with the character of my garden:)
                 
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                • Novice Rob

                  Novice Rob Apprentice Gardener

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                  Most of the ones I have planted thus far have done pretty well. My fear of pruning originates from the first one I planted, which I pruned very heavily the first winter (6 years ago? - ish), and still looks like this (photo attached). :sad: 20190721_164027.jpg
                   
                • ARMANDII

                  ARMANDII Low Flying Administrator Staff Member

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                  Do you know what variety of rose that is, Rob???? Woo:love30: will give you further advice I'm sure. Do you feed the roses? . what type of soil do you have in the garden. I have sandy, but well enriched soil, and have found that certain roses do not as well as they should, while others romp away. Those that "struggle" get a more frequent feed of Tomato Feed along with a mixture liquid Seaweed feed than the others but I do feed them at least once weekly.
                   
                • wiseowl

                  wiseowl FRIENDLY ADMIN Staff Member

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                  Good evening @Novice Rob how much sun does it get and it looks like it struggling for nutrients and is in competition with other plants:smile:
                   
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                  • Novice Rob

                    Novice Rob Apprentice Gardener

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                    Hello both.

                    I'm afraid I don't remember the variety as my mum bought it for us when we first moved in (my wife thinks it was called Charlotte, but doesn't seem particularly sure). It had yellow flowers and was doing quite well until I over-pruned it (it had black spot and I erroneously [sic] believed I needed to remove all the infected stems).

                    The soil is clayey, and I occasionally put horse or cow manure on it.

                    You're right about the lack of light. There is an adjacent honeysuckle which I planted at the same time. I cut it back last year and meant to do the same this year, but by the time I got round to it, there appeared to be a blackbird nesting so I thought I'd better leave it.

                    Thanks so much for taking the time
                    Rob
                     
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                    • wiseowl

                      wiseowl FRIENDLY ADMIN Staff Member

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                      Good evening @Novice Rob no worries my friend I have all the time in the world for people and Roses:smile: is there any chance that you could possibly move,most Roses do need at least 4/6 hours of sunlight apart from a few,clay is fine, and it being so close to the wall is probably a disadvantage as that probably is part of the reason for the black spot,there's no urgency until Oct/Nov time ,if you have anymore questions please don't hesitate to ask my friend:smile:

                      Dedicated to Charlotte, one of David Austin’s granddaughters.
                      Shrub. English Rose Collection. Yellow, orange shading. Moderate fragrance. Medium, very full (41+ petals), in small clusters bloom form. Blooms in flushes throughout the season. Height of 3' to 6' (90 to 185 cm). Width of 4' to 5' (120 to 150 cm). David C. H. Austin (1992).

                      The-Poets-Wife-David-Austin-roses-com-700-700x600.jpg
                       
                    • ARMANDII

                      ARMANDII Low Flying Administrator Staff Member

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                      Hu Rob, If it is Rose Charlotte as your Good Lady suggests:love30:, then I agree with Woo with his advice and diagnosis:thumbsup: I take it you knew it to be a Shrub rose and were treating it as such?
                      I would recommd feeding it with Tomato feed, and Seaweed feed even at this late stage in the season to help it get back to stronger and better health.. It might take a couple of weeks to see a difference if you feed, say, every 4 days or so and keep it up weekly once you see the difference.
                      Such posts as yours are a great help to other members of the Gang who might be having similar problems

                      [​IMG]
                       

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                      • Novice Rob

                        Novice Rob Apprentice Gardener

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                        Those certainly look like the blooms we had the first year. I was convinced it was a climber, but may have got my wires crossed.
                        I'll try moving it in the winter as, even with the honeysuckle cut back, that bit of border doesn't get an awful lot of sun.
                        Thanks again
                        Rob
                         
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